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Anyone out there choosing to use CLAP over the (tm) Vst standard.

S

sintil8

Active member
Dear reader,
I have been reading and following the info that the CLAP development team have been putting out for the last couple of years
and have started using CLAP flavoured versions of plugins that I have on my system.
I have not had any problems crashes or glitches from them and see them as being stable.
Are any of you folk out there making this transition also?

Couple of bit's of trivia/thoughts, please read...

https://audiosex.pro/threads/what-if-we-ditched-the-vst-format-in-the-future.64598/

the CLAP logo. :D

urs.silvrback.com

Urs Heckmann - CLAP

CLAP - and why it's a great name for an audio plug-in ABI
urs.silvrback.com

Regards to all.
 
I only had one CLAP Plugin, that was the Demo of the Fabfilter Pro-Q 4.

I check https://clapdb.tech from time to time to see if any plugin is updated on CLAP.

Don't know what difference it would make for the Stuff I use now, beside the Open Source aspect and the Steinberg Licensing stuff...

Would be nice if any Plugin get more Multicore CPU love so I can use more of it the same time.
And Atmos Audio Multichannel support would be also nice to have.

So I keep looking what's coming.

Tried also to code a CLAP Plugin myself, but this was only a one evening Playaround, than I lost interest because I did not know what I want to build :)
So if anyone has some user friendly Documentation how to make CLAP Plugins, please post your findings. thx.
And maybe I find interest in it again.
 
@RobWJ :cool:

Yeah, it's a slow moving train, interesting tho' that SO1 has acknowledged it's existence and include it as a plugin format.
They must see something positive in it?

If the info that the developers have been putting out can be backed up it sounds promising !
There's a growing list of developers and with midi2 becoming a reality, I hope it grows to include more of the major players.
Fab Filter amongst others have taken the plunge, others may follow in time, maybe the suggested benefits are real.

At the moment it's hard to make any real blood and guts tests to see if things like thread pooling and such give the suggested returns for the end user.

I'm not a programer, but from what I understand most of the info and Documentation resides on GitHub (which, to be honest confuses the S*%T out of me).😅

Best regards.
 
sintil8 said:
Are any of you folk out there making this transition also?
Click to expand...
Nope.

No point in doing so for me.

Frankly, I think stuff like CLAP is more of a political thing than anything else. In reality, developers need to support and maintain yet another format. For the end user, there's no relevance at all.

I rather hope that Steinberg fixes the shortcomings of VST3 (especially in regard to MIDI), and makes the standard more open, as everyone benefits from VST plugins being developed. I don't need yet another format.

I'm pretty positive that Steinberg will do that in the future.
 
@chakko

Yeah I get the train of thought, I also get the shortcomings of Vst3 and developers need to support another format.
Not being a developer I wouldn't know if coding a CLAP plugin is any easier or harder than VST3. One thing with CLAP is Developers can have an input into it's development if they want.

Steinberg fixed vst2 good and proper, I suppose I'm just being a bit flippant saying that, but I do see your point.

As for the relevance Presonus seem to see some milage in it. The politics are another matter, I still use Cubase, it has some useful features.
IMHO if there is a an advantage in having CLAP available, I will take it all day long.

Best regards
 
That I am still evaluating, to be honest, not a lot at the moment, but there doesn't seem to be any disadvantage either.
On the plus side the developers are not paying Steinberge licensing which may be benefiting them.

Wish I could give you it's... all over the rainbow and unicorns pop out of the GUI nonesense, however tech is not a static beast.
Keeping pace and taking advantage of innovation are par for the course.

Anyway as this of no relevance to you, can I at least thank you for reading and taking time to comment.

All the best
 
I guess you know this sketch. ;)

standards.png
 
Presently, I dont see enough detail about clap. The link from the OP was pretty vague, so I saw Uh-he and searched there. Theres a little more detail, but to be honest, I'd pay more attention to a standard non mfr approach (such as a more universal std, like MIDI, or some equivalent). The article doesn't provide much info except some modular way to interface plugins, vco's and more synth based parameters. Thats both nothing new, and the whole thing is too vague, imo. What's it look like?, how does it impact exiting workflow? Is it fully compatible with existing VST or modular layouts. Does it add some other mixer or panel that co-exists with current DAW layouts. No thank you. Too little to chew on, except some fluf on why they named it Clap.
.....connotations, aside! 😆

Here's another link that seems to provide more. https://u-he.com/community/clap/

If anyone has any real steak sauce about clap, feel free to link it. Thanks.

Sonically, it should be an improvement, I'll guess.
 
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@chakko
Yes, remind me of the numbers that are quoted when using it.

Regards
 
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lokeyfly said:
Presently, I dont see enough detail about clap. The link from the OP was pretty vague, so I saw Uh-he and searched there. Theres a little more detail, but to be honest, I'd pay more attention to a standard non mfr approach (such as a more universal std, like MIDI, or some equivalent). The article doesn't provide much info except some modular way to interface plugins. Thats both nothing new, and the whole thing is too vague, imo. What's it look like?, how does it impact exiting workflow? Is it fully compatible with existing VST layouts. Does it add some other mixer that co-exists with current DAW mixers. No thank you. To little to chew on, except some fluf on why they named it Clap.
.....connotations, aside! 😆

Here's another link that seems to provide more. https://u-he.com/community/clap/

If anyone has any real steak sauce about clap, feel free to link it. Thanks.
Click to expand...

That's the thing, SO1 have taken it on board, I'm trying to work out why and where we are heading...
More info can be found here.

ADC 24: Going deeper with CLAP - CLever Audio Plug-In

CLever Audio Plug-in, the open standard for audio plug-ins and hosts
cleveraudio.org cleveraudio.org

There's a lot of tech info lying around. I'm trying to learn more about it myself. The CLAP folk seem to be pushing ahead and it's in SO1's crosshairs for some reason. I don't think they would be creating code to run CLAP plugins unless there was some mileage in it.

Best regards.
 
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I can't decide whether CLAP will sink or swim. I haven't used it yet but as an end user I'm happy to do so if it becomes the dominant format or if it gives me any real advantages. But I can see how DAW developers might be reluctant to support it, because they will have to continue to support VST3, AU, and AAX as well as the new kid on the block, which means more testing and more potential for bugs. I'm a bit surprised Presonus have been so quick to implement it. If you are a company that makes plugins they'd have to be brave to only ship them as CLAP so it's more effort for them too.

But if you are in the UK and of a certain age your first thought was probably "Why the heck did they call it that????" Clap definition
 
My guess is clap may be for the synth purists from the fact that Bidset and U-He are in on the ground floor. In that scheme of things, the whole modular oscillators, and filters would prove to be richer and truer to analog. Perhaps clap enters into mixers with more realistic filtering and other goodness. Well, progress is always a good thing, as long as it doesn't involve revamping things. I surely won't be doing that at this stage of the game. I truly doubt someone is going to jump up and state that song uses clap! We'll just have to wait and see how Studio One implements this. Perhaps the developers can streamline that transition. They (Presonus) do that very well. Look at how well they implemented Atmos, mix console plugs and other developments. So sit tight. ; )
......me thinks.
 
If I had to guess, they'll be these containors that can be customized. Sort of like controller maps, only with more of a truer more dedicated circuit architecture. Thats just what I'm invisioning from the last video I sent. He says you can d'load beta versions linked to the channel.

I guess we'll hear soon enough if it can be implemented just yet in Studio One. So I wouldn't load them just yet. You'd probably use Bidset for the time being.

If that name is any indicator of success..... ehmmm. I dont know.
 
@Davey
the UK colloquialism of CLAP, someone in Europe is probably having a chuckle at the Brits for saying Europeans don't have a sense of humour.🤣
Being of a certain age shouldn't be a problem.
as long as you are not trying to put penecillin into a USB socket cause the puters got a virus.

On the note of sink or swim and bugs etc., VST3 seems to be doing a pretty good job at that, whilst Plugin developers have been busy recoding from Vst2. Maybe CLAP it's a choice they can make for themselves. There was no choice when Vst2 got burned.

Best regards
 
lokeyfly said:
If I had to guess, they'll be these containors that can be customized. Sort of like controller maps, only with more of a truer more dedicated circuit architecture. Thats just what I'm invisioning from the last video I sent. He says you can d'load beta versions linked to the channel.

I guess we'll hear soon enough if it can be implemented just yet in Studio One. So I wouldn't load them just yet. You'd probably use Bidset for the time being.

If that name is any indicator of success..... ehmmm. I dont know.
Click to expand...
Lokey,
I'm not sure I follow the containers idea/logic, I don't see it as a plugin wrapper.

From what I can understand the code is doing the same as a VST only using newer code that has expanded functions that VST3 does not provide at the mo', but that's just my laymans understanding.

As for being implemented in SO1 you can run CLAP plugins now.

Your previous post above, CLAP is also being used to compile/create FX plugins.
Maybe it will wither on the vine, but if folk like us (Daw users) start talking and asking questions then any benefits that it might have should become evident.

There are also references in the CLAP blurb about it being robust when saving and transferring projects to overcome problems with missing samples etc. It's a lot to take in, in one bite... and it's an ongoing moving situation. It's very much a wait and see game, which is one of the reasons I posted the question.

Kindest regards.
 
sintil8 said:
Lokey,
As for being implemented in SO1 you can run CLAP plugins now.
Click to expand...
I see. I didnt see it as a wrapper, but more like a modular sort of plugin that modulation of vco's or filters could be patched. Based off of that video. I'll keep an eye out on it, just the same.
sintil8 said:
Your previous post above, CLAP is also being used to compile/create FX plugins.
Maybe it will wither on the vine, but if folk like us (Daw users) start talking and asking questions then any benefits that it might have should become evident.
Click to expand...
Agreed.
 
lokeyfly said:
I see. I didnt see it as a wrapper, but more like a modular sort of plugin that modulation of vco's or filters could be patched. Based off of that video. I'll keep an eye out on it, just the same.

Agreed.
Click to expand...
Sorry, I didn't mean to take the words out of your mouth. It's just me being a bit clumsy, "wrapper". 🫥

It's all good tho' I'm just bemused that CLAP is not being discussed, and to add to that Studio one would need the operators and midi functions similar to Bitwig. Another Daw has recently introduced similar midi operators that play a similar role. Maybe a couple of iterations of SO1 will see something similar. Me I'm just a curious old beast that enjoys noodling around and loves music for the music.

Kindest regards
 
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