Pro Navigator feedback

[Trommler]

Hello Lukas,


Firstly, let me say that I have great respect for your work in Studio Pro. However, many of the functions of the Pro Navigator should already be a natural part of Studio Pro. Fender's Studio Pro development team should once again step up their game when it comes to innovations. The only term that comes to mind is the term 'lame duck'.

Artificial intelligence is on everyone's lips. A modern DAW should be able to automatically recognize the content of individual audio and MIDI tracks using artificial intelligence, name them according to personal specifications, sort them as desired, mark them in color, assign appropriate track symbols, create desired folder structures, create markers, recognize empty spaces inside audio tracks, construct an arranger track, create a chord track, recognize lyrics, recognize tone/beat type, recognize tempo, recognize timing fluctuations, automates gain staging, optimize frequencies, recognize frequency overlaps, create dynamic stabilities, create desired routings with aux, sends and sub-bus structures and much more. Everything fully automatic with one click. When it comes to modern innovations, software developers still seem to be stuck in the Middle Ages. Not just at Fender.

This would also make the above script tool obsolete. Sorry for that. Until then, I personally use the free Color Toolbar Script for automatic coloring. Color Toolbar. Nevertheless, thank you very much for your self-sacrificing work to make Studio Pro better.

 

[Lukas]

Hi Trommler,

thanks for reaching out.

Sure, it would also be nice if every computer came with an audio interface, a full DAW and every sample library and plugin you could ever need. But that's not the reality. Studio Pro has the features it has, and my add-ons provide extra functionality for people who need them or find them useful. Nobody has to buy or use them.

If you think certain features should be part of Studio Pro itself, that's perfectly valid feedback - but Fender is the right recipient for it. An optional add-on exists precisely to provide functionality that isn't part of the core application.

And if the free Color Toolbar already does what you need, that's great - use it. It's still a great tool.

 

[Vocalpoint]

Artificial intelligence is on everyone's lips.

Not everyone.

A modern DAW should be able to automatically recognize the content of individual audio and MIDI tracks using artificial intelligence, name them according to personal specifications, sort them as desired, mark them in color, assign appropriate track symbols, create desired folder structures, create markers, recognize empty spaces inside audio tracks, construct an arranger track, create a chord track, recognize lyrics, recognize tone/beat type, recognize tempo, recognize timing fluctuations, automates gain staging, optimize frequencies, recognize frequency overlaps, create dynamic stabilities, create desired routings with aux, sends and sub-bus structures and much more.

And when exactly - would we learn how to do anything?

I might be in the minority - but I have zero use for any "Ai" help with any of the above.

I would rather learn how to do it all myself.

VP

 

[TimC340]

Even the main generative AI DAWs - Suno Studio and ACE Studio - don’t do any of that stuff, so I think one will be waiting some time for it to appear as an option in more mainstream DAWs.

 

[Trommler]

I would rather learn how to do it all myself.

VP

Of course, you could approach the matter that way. With all the consequences, this would mean completely foregoing modern computer technology and working in the old school way, exclusively with analog mixing consoles and tape machines. This requires a high level of knowledge for everyday studio life. Not to forget the high investments in analog studio technology. Personally, I choose a different path and have high expectations when it comes to modern computer programs. It really annoys me when recurring standard tasks are not taken over fully automatically by the digital DAW. This tires me out immensely and there is hardly any improvement in sight.

 

[Vocalpoint]

Of course, you could approach the matter that way.

I do approach it this way.

With all the consequences, this would mean completely foregoing modern computer technology and working in the old school way, exclusively with analog mixing consoles and tape machines. This requires a high level of knowledge for everyday studio life. Not to forget the high investments in analog studio technology.

Consequences? No one is saying any user with little interest in AI - suddenly needs to buy a Neve desk and a tape machine.

Ironically - to me - the only real consequence of actually learning your tools (and your craft) the old fashioned way - IS a high level of knowledge for everyday studio life.

Isn't this what we should all be chasing in one way or another?

Personally, I choose a different path and have high expectations when it comes to modern computer programs. It really annoys me when recurring standard tasks are not taken over fully automatically by the digital DAW. This tires me out immensely and there is hardly any improvement in sight.

If using SP actually "tires" you out - and the only remedy you can come up with is a sad crutch like Ai - respectfully - your comment feels like either laziness or a lack of interest (or both) rearing it's head. Or - maybe this gig just isn't for you.

To close - this topic (Ai slop) is taking a hard skew away from the spirit of this thread - which should be feedback on Lukas awesome new addon. Maybe we can consider getting back there?

VP

 

[TimC340]

Of course, you could approach the matter that way. With all the consequences, this would mean completely foregoing modern computer technology and working in the old school way, exclusively with analog mixing consoles and tape machines. This requires a high level of knowledge for everyday studio life. Not to forget the high investments in analog studio technology. Personally, I choose a different path and have high expectations when it comes to modern computer programs. It really annoys me when recurring standard tasks are not taken over fully automatically by the digital DAW. This tires me out immensely and there is hardly any improvement in sight.

Your high expectations will be dashed.

 

[Trommler]

Even the main generative AI DAWs - Suno Studio and ACE Studio - don’t do any of that stuff, so I think one will be waiting some time for it to appear as an option in more mainstream DAWs.

With modern studio technologies, much more powerful functions can currently be implemented than the (studio) software providers generally want to allow us. The motto here is probably: slow, sluggish and sometimes backwards. Unfortunately, most of us will remain dependent on software developers. This tires me enormously. Not just at Fender.

 

[TimC340]

I think you over-estimate the music community's appetite for AI assistance. Most of us actually enjoy the process, and so far the few instances of non-generative AI introduced to music software (by SSL, iZotope, Sonible and maybe a few others) have not set the world alight. It maybe that someday soon they'll have capabilities that trained ears can't match, but I doubt it, frankly. I'm all for tech in most areas of my life - including my studio - but AI in creative arts is generally unwelcome.

 

[Trommler]

I think you over-estimate the music community's appetite for AI assistance. Most of us actually enjoy the process, and so far the few instances of AI introduced to music software (by SSL, iZotope, Sonible and maybe a few others) have not set the world alight. It maybe that someday soon they'll have capabilities that trained ears can't match, but I doubt it, frankly. I'm all for tech in most areas of my life - including my studio - but AI in creative arts is generally unwelcome.

The new Pro Navigator script from @Lukas aims to automate recurring standard tasks outside the creative process as much as possible in order to save time. You have to be very grateful to @Lukas for that. For the Fender development team, this add-on from @Lukas should be more of a slap in the face. That's embarrassing. That's actually all I wanted to express. And do not forget. This tool is not for free.

 

[SwitchBack]

Life with AI becomes interesting when it answers a request with: "It can't be done." What then, the 5 stages of grief? Do we simply accept the answer presented by someone's clever programming? Will anyone still possess the knowledge and the skills to prove AI wrong, or even dare stage an attempt to do so? Will such a person be ridiculed for trying? Interesting times ahead, and lots of dumb* people...

* Dumb adjective
- 4: (of a computer terminal) able only to transmit data to or receive data from a computer; having no independent processing capability. Often contrasted with intelligent.

 

[TimC340]

The new Pro Navigator script from @Lukas aims to automate recurring standard tasks outside the creative process as much as possible in order to save time. You have to be very grateful to @Lukas for that. For the Fender development team, this add-on from @Lukas should be more of a slap in the face. That's embarrassing. That's actually all I wanted to express. And do not forget. This tool is not for free.

I very much appreciate Lukas' efforts, and I have bought Pro Navigator. I don't see it quite like you do, but I'm very used to software getting mods from enthusiastic users (I know Lukas is rather more than that). But I don't interpret any part of Pro Navigator as AI; it gives me several QoL features - some of which I'll use and some I won't (as can equally be said of the DAW itself). You can of course argue that some of this stuff could have been provided by Fender, and I wouldn't disagree, but no software is perfect and improvements can always be made. But I'm not advocating for AI to take over any part of the process. I can see some utility in AI automating some admin tasks in the DAW, but I think the effort needed to arrange that is out of proportion to the benefit.

 

[Trommler]

I can see some utility in AI automating some admin tasks in the DAW, but I think the effort needed to arrange that is out of proportion to the benefit.

In this context we seem to differ significantly. For me personally, a modern computer serves to automate recurring standard tasks and thus relieve the user so that they can concentrate on the creative and musical aspects. For me, this is an elementary part of a functional DAW. In this respect, the software developers of the established DAW providers seem to live in the boring past without any real visions and innovations. This tires me extremely. The consequences of this are, among other things, that people like Lukas feel compelled to supplement missing functions with their own additional programs. This should actually be completely unnecessary. With all due respect to the work of Lukas and other script providers.

The only thing that can be credited to Fender is the fact that Studio Pro's scripting language will allow additional program parts to be engineered from outside. But that is very little consolation for me personally and continues to be very embarrassing for Fender.

An important function of the Pro Navigator is to recognize track names via the script language, to automatically color them and to create corresponding track symbols. Artificial intelligence can do this much more effectively and innovatively, as the track content can be analyzed. Anyone who leaves out these important functions in today's DAW programs is, in my opinion, acting negligently at the expense of the user. This is not acceptable.

I myself expect these highly polished and full-bodied advertising campaigns from DAW providers to be full-fledged products without any weaknesses. This doesn't just apply to Fender. However, reality speaks a completely different language. That's just sad.

 

[Vocalpoint]

I myself expect these highly polished and full-bodied advertising campaigns from DAW providers to be full-fledged products without any weaknesses.

Welcome to the real world pal. When you find one of these products with no weaknesses - be sure to let us know.

But again - your post again circles right back to Ai slop - which is not the subject (or spirit) of this thread.

If you actually want to take a run at talking Ai slop - maybe consider starting your own thread.

VP

 

[TimC340]

In this context we seem to differ significantly. For me personally, a modern computer serves to automate recurring standard tasks and thus relieve the user so that they can concentrate on the creative and musical aspects. For me, this is an elementary part of a functional DAW. In this respect, the software developers of the established DAW providers seem to live in the boring past without any real visions and innovations. This tires me extremely. The consequences of this are, among other things, that people like Lukas feel compelled to supplement missing functions with their own additional programs. This should actually be completely unnecessary. With all due respect to the work of Lukas and other script providers.

The only thing that can be credited to Fender is the fact that Studio Pro's scripting language will allow additional program parts to be engineered from outside. But that is very little consolation for me personally and continues to be very embarrassing for Fender.

An important function of the Pro Navigator is to recognize track names via the script language, to automatically color them and to create corresponding track symbols. Artificial intelligence can do this much more effectively and innovatively, as the track content can be analyzed. Anyone who leaves out these important functions in today's DAW programs is, in my opinion, acting negligently at the expense of the user. This is not acceptable.

I myself expect these highly polished and full-bodied advertising campaigns from DAW providers to be full-fledged products without any weaknesses. This doesn't just apply to Fender. However, reality speaks a completely different language. That's just sad.

I doubt Fender is in the slightest bit embarrassed that you find using its music software tiresome! And they don't make access to their scripting available to just anyone; Lukas is one of very few who have any access at all.

I look forward to your reviews of a DAW that fulfils your AI ambitions. As far as I am aware, there isn't one and none are planned - even by those manufacturers who promote generative AI. Fender are not unique. As for 'this is not acceptable', forgive me while I ROFL!

 

[BobF]

@Trommler - Please start a new thread in the Lounge if you want to discuss the virtues of AI and lament the lack of FSP support for it.

 

[Stuart Welwood]

When it comes to making improvements or additions to a software product, it always comes down to a compromise. It's a balance between how much it costs to implement and how much value it adds to the product in the eyes of customers.