Help! from any Sound Variation experts...

[freddiphin]

My Sound Variations Issues

I am working on setting up new SVs frequently and find the file organization structure frustrating. The folder(s) that hold them, ...\Studio One\Presets\User Presets\Key Switches, does not seem to update or refresh with any logic (that I understand) - for example, it doesn't seem to rescan the Keyswitches folder when restarting. And, more frustratingly, SV files that I create and place in sub-folders within that file structure and later make changes to those SVs and choose "Update Preset" in the SV Editor, the "update" gets silently created as a New file (with the same name) in the root folder, NOT an update to the existing file in its own folder as I would presume. This and none of the "Store preset" actions give the user any confirmation (for example if using the same name of an existing) or clear view of what is happening.
This has made for duplicates, confusing "extra" versions of believed updated files in the wrong place, and all kinds of file management confusion!

Is this a bug that I should take up with PreSonus or perhaps is there a protocol that I may need to learn still?
For sure the "Update" function shouldn't work like that, no?

 

[freddiphin]

Still hoping for some SV expertise!
I have, and still am, trying to soak it all in from Lukas' and Markus' tutorials, but SVs aren't quite always as straightforward as they want (I want them?) to be. And I know they have likely been updated a few times since the bulk of the tutorial videos in the last couple years, so...

One thing I cannot find which I had been taking for granted: How does one link a Sound Variation to its associated Note(s) so that moving the note moves the SV with it?? There is a toggle for "Select Automation with Notes", where is the same function for the SVs? Is this hidden somewhere? I cannot find it. Surely this should just be the default behavior, no?

 

[OutrageProductions]

Of the 4 DAWs that I run consistently, none of them will copy/move an articulation (SV) trigger with an individual MIDI note in a Piano Roll edit view. They can, and do, copy/move with arrangement sections in a track view however.

 

[Lukas]

I am working on setting up new SVs frequently and find the file organization structure frustrating. The folder(s) that hold them, ...\Studio One\Presets\User Presets\Key Switches, does not seem to update or refresh with any logic (that I understand) - for example, it doesn't seem to rescan the Keyswitches folder when restarting.

You have to click "Re-Index Presets" on the Home tab of the Browser. This re-scans for changes on disk.

And, more frustratingly, SV files that I create and place in sub-folders within that file structure and later make changes to those SVs and choose "Update Preset" in the SV Editor, the "update" gets silently created as a New file (with the same name) in the root folder, NOT an update to the existing file in its own folder as I would presume. This and none of the "Store preset" actions give the user any confirmation (for example if using the same name of an existing) or clear view of what is happening.
This has made for duplicates, confusing "extra" versions of believed updated files in the wrong place, and all kinds of file management confusion!

That's true. Updating existing maps is not at all ideal. I provided feedback on that back then, but there haven't been any Sound Variation related updates since 2021 as far as I know.

One thing I cannot find which I had been taking for granted: How does one link a Sound Variation to its associated Note(s) so that moving the note moves the SV with it?? There is a toggle for "Select Automation with Notes", where is the same function for the SVs? Is this hidden somewhere? I cannot find it. Surely this should just be the default behavior, no?

It should be, but unfortunately, it's not possible. It's another aspect that I had given a lot of feedback about when SVs were introduced. There needs to be a way to attach Sound Variations to notes.

"Select Automation with Notes" actually works for SVs as well, so it can help selecting the SVs with the notes. But depending on the exact positions, it doesn't always work so an actual "Attach SVs to Notes" workflow would be preferred.

Which is also why the feature request had more than 100 votes in the Answers base:

Highest voted questions in Sound Variations - Questions & Answers | PreSonus

Of the 4 DAWs that I run consistently, none of them will copy/move an articulation (SV) trigger with an individual MIDI note in a Piano Roll edit view. They can, and do, copy/move with arrangement sections in a track view however.

Logic's Articulation Sets do that by default. In Cubase, you can use "Attributes" which do (kind of) the same. A lot of composers work this way so it's definitely something one might want to have in Studio One as well.

 

[ravez]

As a potential limited workaround, If you right click on a note and go to Articulations, you are gonna see a list (Staccato, Staccatissimo, etc) that you can bind to your sound variations from the sound variations window.
So take Staccato for example, if you have that sound variation, you can assign it the Staccato articulation (Score symbol) in the sound variations window, and now you can assign that articulation directly to the note in the midi editor via right click > Articulations > Staccato
Now if you move that note anywhere, no matter the current sound variation, it will stick to Staccato.
You can also combine some of them.
Honestly the whole sound variations thing had a lot of potential when it was introduced, but it feels half baked and limited, and not for lack of feedback.
But never say never, Cubase improved expression maps after "only" 15 years

 

[freddiphin]

Thanks. Good to know I'm not alone in this. I have had the problems elsewhere with this type of thing and had hoped the S1 SV style was going to be better. Which it is in some ways.

Which is also why the feature request had more than 100 votes in the Answers base:
Highest voted questions in Sound Variations - Questions & Answers | PreSonus

Where actually do we go for Feature Requests? When I click on that link, Lukas, it gives me a 404 error.



And

As a potential limited workaround, If you right click on a note and go to Articulations, you are gonna see a list (Staccato, Staccatissimo, etc) that you can bind to your sound variations from the sound variations window.

When I do this and have a score-based articulation (which I would MUCH prefer for all, or as many as can be) set as an SV, once that articulation has triggered once it stays on, despite having following SVs triggered by Score Articulations (then seen in the "Musical Symbols" lane) or SVs in their lane, to the effect of having different articulation samples building up in layers and all playing simultaneously. This is, of course, highly undesired and I've found no help for it, so I stay away from using it, sadly. This is, perhaps, an issue with my Kontakt CineSamples CineStrings library only - which is the bulk of my work at the moment. For sure it's not right, but maybe a niche problem affecting maybe just me on this forum....

 

[ravez]

Thanks. Good to know I'm not alone in this. I have had the problems elsewhere with this type of thing and had hoped the S1 SV style was going to be better. Which it is in some ways.


Where actually do we go for Feature Requests? When I click on that link, Lukas, it gives me a 404 error.



And

When I do this and have a score-based articulation (which I would MUCH prefer for all, or as many as can be) set as an SV, once that articulation has triggered once it stays on, despite having following SVs triggered by Score Articulations (then seen in the "Musical Symbols" lane) or SVs in their lane, to the effect of having different articulation samples building up in layers and all playing simultaneously. This is, of course, highly undesired and I've found no help for it, so I stay away from using it, sadly. This is, perhaps, an issue with my Kontakt CineSamples CineStrings library only - which is the bulk of my work at the moment. For sure it's not right, but maybe a niche problem affecting maybe just me on this forum....

I don't have CineSamples, but are you using "type" NoteOn+NoteOff messages in the sound variations? as opposed to using just NoteOn which would end up stacking them, just a guess but worth checking

 

[freddiphin]

I don't have CineSamples, but are you using "type" NoteOn+NoteOff messages in the sound variations? as opposed to using just NoteOn which would end up stacking them, just a guess but worth checking

I use NoteOn+NoteOff for SVs, yes. And the stacking ONLY occurs when associating Score articulations with the SVs. In other words, the exact SVs, with the same action lists, can be triggered from the SV lane without the stacking occurring, but if I add the Score articulation association in the SV editor and call for them in the score/notes , the stacking occurs. It's as if the "Musical Symbols" function has its own hidden action list that, indeed, lacks the "NoteOff" call.